Private channel session 1170
42 messages over 1h 26m, 2021-03-29 – 2021-03-29.
A “conversation” here is an activity session — a run of messages with under 60 minutes of silence inside it. The channel had no native conversation boundaries.
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@Kristian Andersen Very interesting... I assume no pango lineage yet? One to watch, I guess.
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@Kristian Andersen C.36
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@Kristian Andersen (but it may be a sublineage of this which would make it C.36.1)
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@Kristian Andersen shared file(s): C.36.ml.tree.pdf
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@Kristian Andersen Need to work out where on this tree the VOCy mutations arise
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@Kristian Andersen But very 'Egypty' over all
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@Kristian Andersen Oh, yeah, that does look very "Egypty". https://outbreak.info/situation-reports?pango=C.36
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@Kristian Andersen .1 appears to be Canada? https://outbreak.info/situation-reports?pango=C.36.1&loc=USA &loc=USA_US-CA&selected=Worldwide
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@Kristian Andersen The blue clade has Spike L452R, Spike Q677H, Spike S12F and the green clade has some extras plus the 69/70 deletion [shared file(s): image.png]
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@Kristian Andersen Ah, okay - so not all _that_ mutationally 'saturated'. That's a pretty big clade though - and Ididn't quite realize how many mutations pop up in ORF1ab, although that's of course a very big gene.
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Just chatting to Dominic now.
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I started to write another email to Bonin pointing out the fact-free bullshit. We'll see where this goes - I'm thinking that Eddie is albsolutely right about the pulled punches. We should take some of the worthy facts out of the report and write a punched up PO2 - just the facts - by that I mean the science.
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It's kinda scary - I mean, Pottinger is directly accusing China of creating this virus for military purposes, yet, hedoesn't need to provide any evidence at all?
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Decided it wasn't worth to electrons to point out the crap - different agenda - just trying to get viewers.
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Yeah, that's not journalism.
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(same for the CNN documentary)
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It's February, 2003 all over again. Although, I don't understand if Pottinger is just saying this shit or whether this isactually the position of the USG?
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Plus both Pottinger and Metzl are getting their science-free information from Asher. My wife listened to Metzl for about two minutes and said - he's just like Joseph Fair. She was right about Covidfaker and she's right about Metzl.
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Yes exactly - Saddam has the bioweapons - we need to bomb Iraq back to the stone age. Jamie's 9 sequences "But we do know that there were 9 viruses at least that were brought back. And it's extremely possible that among these viruses is a virus that's much more closely related to the SARS-CoV-2 virus. And when I put all those pieces together, I said, "Hey, wait a second, this is a real possibility. We need to be exploring it." - is November 2016 all over again and Hillarie's 30,000 mails and James Comey.
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It's the same BS machine over and over again. Both of them seemed very convincing on 60 Minutes though - and it's clear it's part of their training in politics (the big giveaway is the smiling every time they make a point - Iremember Matt Stremlau always did the same (from his years in politics...) and it's a very very effective way to builda human connection and get a point across. Peter D. totally outmatched here - with his serious stare and demeanor)
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I almost felt sorry for PD - but he was not very well prepared for obvious questions and he also likely got heavily edited.
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He got edited for sure, but one thing that stuck with me - he wasn't over-claiming anything. "Yup, we don't know", "Yup, that's to be done". Doesn't work to convince a lay audience, but it's sticking to what we know and what wedon't.
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Stahl had follow-up for each PD question designed to put him off balance and admit stuff he shouldn't have admitted. Surprising with all the media that he's not better at it. The follow-up to JM and MP were shocked looks onher face and gasps.
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Yup - she clearly drank the Kool-Aid before the interview. Also, 2 lab leak 'theorists' vs 1 scientist. Fair balance?Nope - should have been 0 vs 3.
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Annex D7 is very interesting
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Had a long chat with Dominic: (i) he thinks that it could well be raccoon dogs or mink neither of which have been tested and that there was great push back from the Chinese about even investigating this idea. So, these animals have not been tested; (ii) he said that the WIV staff came across as totally open and honest. He said that privately Shi told them she was very worried about a lab escape and they did 2 internal audits and found nothing.
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This? [shared file(s): Screen Shot 2021-03-29 at 4.22.14 PM.png]
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"Shi told them she was very worried about a lab escape and they did 2 internal audits and found nothing". This bit bothers me - and I mentioned this back when she made a similar comment to SciAm. It clearly shows she found it a likely explanation.
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... but they again, she _would_ need to consider it a possibility - we did.
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As did we Kristian. I think I would be more bothered if she had not considered the possibility. To me, she comes across as honest.
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What do you make of that ACE2 stuff? If all their staff are negative then it's game over....unless there's been massive cover-up.
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"her laboratory used recombinant viruses to test whether bat CoVs could use ACE2 to bind but used bat spike protein on *a bat-CoV backbone*, not human SARS" Which backbone?
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"*other researchers* engineered SHC014 spike so did not need isolates for mouse experiments. WIV began recombinant work in 2015 with WIV-1. It received ACE2 mice in 2016 and *started recombinant experiments with WIV +SHC014* in 2018 but did not finish them owing to the COVID outbreak" This might all just be bad writing, but there's a lot of wiggle room in these statements. I'm not really sure how tointerpret them.
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Yes, I couldn't quite follow it either. I guess she means SCH014 which is a SARS-like virus. This accords with her comments to John Cohen that they were only working on SARS-like viruses.
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Dominic also said that it clear that the intelligence services have nothing.
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Yeah, maybe they're just referring to this? https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4797993/
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A lot of the conspiracy theories mention the "GOF Research" at WIV and how they made these scary recombinant viruses - but that work was in DeepThroat's lab, not at WIV - so maybe that's what they're pushing against.
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Yes, that's the one.
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Yeah, I think that's what they're saying - "we did stuff in bats, but the human conspiracy stuff isn't actually us".
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Agreed. And I believe them.
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WHO will apparently hold a press conference overnight my time...I guess tomorrow morning yours.
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... I better get on with reading that report then... Was too busy doing alignments and, you know, something akin toscience :wink: