Chat message

Slack / Private Message Drop, p.74 [SLACK_000288] · slack_pm:msg:00743

Date: 2020-06-11 21:26
Type: chat message · slack
recipient: Robert F. Garry, Edward C. Holmes, Andrew Rambaut
speaker: Kristian G. Andersen
Topics: Natural origin / zoonotic spillover

Recipients on this medium are inferred from channel membership, not per-message addressing.

> would you expect a clinically similar infection in an animal in nature if this had come out of a lab? Don't think one would have an expectation one way or the other - but interesting nonetheless. I find it peculiar that all these pangolins are showing up sick with all sorts of SARS-like CoVs though - I mean, these guys have been traded_forever_ and only now do we realize they have CoVs? Potentially a huge reservoir out there... which is scary.

Extracted statements

Rule-extracted, not adjudicated. The grade says what may be done with each one; read the document above before relying on any of them.

Statement	Grade	Attribution	Stance
I find it peculiar that all these pangolins are showing up sick with all sorts of SARS-like CoVs though - I mean, these guys have been traded_forever_ and only now do we realize they have CoVs?	needs context	speaker_own	questions

Statement

Grade

Attribution

Stance

I find it peculiar that all these pangolins are showing up sick with all sorts of SARS-like CoVs though - I mean, these guys have been traded_forever_ and only now do we realize they have CoVs?

needs context

speaker_own

questions

In context

A single line often inverts meaning once you see what it answers, so neighbouring messages are always shown.

2020-06-11 20:14 Kristian G. Andersen open

:bat:/n Eddie: 80/20 Kristian: 70/30
2020-06-11 20:34 Edward C. Holmes open

90/10. I think.
2020-06-11 20:37 Edward C. Holmes open

Strictly confidentially, I literally (2 mins ago) just got an email that says: "Recently, we isolated a pangolin-Cov that ishighly related with SARS-CoV-2 (https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-020-2313-x). We further found that the infected pangolins showed similar CT scans with COVID-19 patients (please see the attachment, a and b are virus-positive pangolins, while c is virus-negative). Thus, we further did the transcriptome of their multiple tissue, and found they showed similar immune response as that of COVID-19 patients, that is, an inadequate interferonresponse, but excessive inflammatory response and an over-exuberant cytokine response.In addition, we found other interesting results". I don't the viruses are any closer to the ones we have but the clinical/transcriptome results are interesting...if true (you can never tell) would you expect a clinically similar infection in an animal in nature if this had come out of a lab?
2020-06-11 20:38 Edward C. Holmes open

I will of course agree to help to see what more I can discover.
2020-06-11 21:26 Kristian G. Andersen

> would you expect a clinically similar infection in an animal in nature if this had come out of a lab? Don't think one would have an expectation one way or the other - but interesting nonetheless. I find it peculiar that all these pangolins are showing up sick with all sorts of SARS-like CoVs though - I mean, these guys have been traded_forever_ and only now do we realize they have CoVs? Potentially a huge reservoir out there... which is scary.
2020-06-11 21:40 Edward C. Holmes open

Agreed. No one gives a shit and now we are seeing loads of pangolins with frothy lungs. You couldn't make this up.
2020-06-11 21:47 Edward C. Holmes open

Notable that HKU1 does have a furin cleavage site but NL63 doesn't. To me, this trait moves around so much in nature that we can't really say anything: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1866027/
2020-06-11 21:49 Edward C. Holmes open

And they weren't able to culture HKU1.
2020-06-11 22:48 Edward C. Holmes open

Sorry to keep going, but HKU1 is really interesting in this context: (i) has an furin cleavage site (RRKRR) in the right spot; (ii) causes human and has spread (it turned up in Australia; (iii) betacoronavirus; (iv) closest relative is MHV but that is way distant. Could easily be out a bat or another mammal. No one suggested lab escape when this first appeared. [shared file(s): 1828-04.pdf]

Full conversation →