COVID-19 Records

Transcript segment

Baric Transcribed Interview (Redacted), p.128 · baric_ti:utt:01106

Page text: p.128 · original PDF

Date
2026-04-10 09:00 (day precision)
Type
transcript segment · interview
recipient
Christina Salazar, Harry Kazenoff, David T. Lambeth III, William Henderson, Clark Ervin, Jake Greenberg
speaker
Ralph S. Baric
I'm talking about this afternoon. Yeah, please.

In context

A single line often inverts meaning once you see what it answers, so neighbouring messages are always shown.

  1. 2026-04-10 09:00 Christina Salazar open
    I know. But I'm saying I have a document that --
  2. 2026-04-10 09:00 William Henderson open
    Yes, that's unclassified.
  3. 2026-04-10 09:00 Ralph S. Baric open
    Will you let me look at the details of that?
  4. 2026-04-10 09:00 Christina Salazar open
    I mean, if you're not going to be able to answer it right now I don't want to waste our time.
  5. 2026-04-10 09:00 Ralph S. Baric
    I'm talking about this afternoon. Yeah, please.
  6. 2026-04-10 09:00 Christina Salazar open
    Okay. I just want to make sure that we get to everything. Early in 2020, did you ever have any concerns about the safety of SARS-CoV-2 vaccines that were being developed?
  7. 2026-04-10 09:00 Ralph S. Baric open
    So coronavirus vaccines induce Th2 immune DC.Scheduling@LexitasLegal.com pathology using killed vaccines plus alum. So I talked at a WHO meeting early on in the pandemic to say that alumbased vaccines, which have a tendency to -- I probably need to explain what a Th2 immune response is.
  8. 2026-04-10 09:00 Christina Salazar open
    We don't really have to. We'll look it up.
  9. 2026-04-10 09:00 Ralph S. Baric open
    Okay. So basically there's a massive inflammatory response that has the potential to be lifethreatening, and the SARS coronavirus vaccines, from 2003, that the NIH had purchased, were both adjuvanted with alum. And we published papers showing that that drives a strong Th2 immune response. So my concern, and I expressed this to the WHO and to other groups, was that we needed to look carefully for vaccine-induced immune pathology. Ultimately, we published a paper with the VRC. That was one of the experiments we set up to do, where we took mRNA vaccines and we took killed vaccine preparations with alum and compared them head-to-head for the ability to induced Th2 responses. The mRNA vaccines did not cause it. The recombinant protein, or the killed vaccines plus alum caused a big Th2 response. Now, the Chinese vaccines were killed vaccines with alum, which I think was inappropriate. The mRNA vaccines, though, were tested for that using homologous virus challenge. DC.Scheduling@LexitasLegal.com

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